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Thread: Help with Flip jump

  1. #1

    Default Help with Flip jump

    Hi, I am an adult skater and I finally learned the loop jump

    Now i'm working on the flip jump and i'm having a hard time breaking the habit of doing a 1/2 flip jump. I can't get my body to do the full rotation. After I do the LO3 to get my skating foot on the inside edge, my coach says I need to pull my left arm back to start the rotation and then pick my right foot into the ice. I'm having trouble with the timing of this jump. Any tips, on ice or off ice, would be much appreciated

  2. #2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 2006au4kwan
    Hi, I am an adult skater and I finally learned the loop jump

    Now i'm working on the flip jump and i'm having a hard time breaking the habit of doing a 1/2 flip jump. I can't get my body to do the full rotation. After I do the LO3 to get my skating foot on the inside edge, my coach says I need to pull my left arm back to start the rotation and then pick my right foot into the ice. I'm having trouble with the timing of this jump. Any tips, on ice or off ice, would be much appreciated

    Maybe practicing on the floor might help first. I would maybe try doing single rotation jumps from a stand-still position so that you are comfortable with doing single rotation jumps. I'm sure you might already do something like this, but try to keep the emphasis on bending your knees, and bringing your arms into proper position to rotate correctly.

    In my opinion, with the flip jump, it will greatly help if you bend your knees and really exagerrate that movement, along with your arms, to get into a comfortable position to do a rotation in the air.

    From my own observation, many adult skaters I've seen over the years have difficulty using their knees properly, and in turn, their jumps and spins look very rigid and stiff. I think that partially stems from the fear of falling, or maybe trying to be too straight in their body position.

    But again, I think with flips and lutzes, the key to getting good spring into the air is how you use your knees. If you have some good bend as you do the three-turn take-off, you should easily be able to get some good height to draw your arms in and do the turn in the air.

    I hope this helps....I'm writing kinda quick because I have to leave in a minute! haha

    Maybe I'll write a better suggestion later.
    Last edited by scootie12; June 10th, 2006 at 05:50 PM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
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    My coach used to make me do this killer exercise, but it really helped.

    Start from pretty much a stand still and enter the jump, LFO 3 turn, and then when you reach back with your toe pick, plant it in the ice. Without jumping, pull your left foot into right in front of your left foot (the one with the toe pick in the ice), then lift the free leg up into what the jump position would be, spin around on your toe pick, and then kick/push out as if landing the jump. Basically you are doing the jump, just without actually jumping. It really helped for me to improve the timing of my entrance, the proper position, and the feel of starting the jump. It took me awhile to be able to do this exercise properly, as I kept wanting to rush the "spin" part of it. Basically when I was trying to jump, I was jumping too soon, and not letting the edges help me into the jump. This exercise helped to curb that problem. I don't know if it will work for you, but it might be worth a try.

  4. #4

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    These sound great! Iceskaterdawn--did you try to attempt only 1 spin rotation before checking out? Also, is the spin actually on the toe pick or do you do a back spin on the right leg?

    I can't wait to try these suggestions. Since I don't plan to get back to the rink until Monday, I'll try the off ice exercise first.

  5. #5
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    The spin is done ON the toe pick, not as a back spin. I was only doing one rotation as that was hard enough. I'm sure doing more wouldn't hurt. My coach says that you actually get a tiny bit of rotation off the toe pick when you do the actual jump. So you need to make sure that you are getting over your toe pick correctly, and this exercise forces you to transfer and balance your weight over that toe pick. I was trying to jump too much from the left side of my body, and not geting enough "umph" from the toe pick, because I wasn't balancing my weight correctly. You can't spin on your toe pick, if you don't have your weight transfered properly, so this trains your body on how to do that.

    Once I got the hang of this exercise, my coach would have me do the exercise 2 times, and then try a flip jump. Then go back to the exercise 2 times, and then the jump, etc. I also did this exercise for the lutz jump.

    It took me awhile (but I also have a serious knee issues after having 4 surgeries on my right knee), so I had to keep flip and lutz practices very short to not aggrevate my knee too much. I could only spend a very short time per day on those jumps, so my progress was much slower than most.

  6. #6

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    Iceskaterdawn--thanks for clarifying that for me. That does sound like a grueling exercise! I also tend to rush into my jumps and I constantly have to tell myself to slow down. I will try to do this exercise on ice Monday night and i'll be sure to let you guys know how it goes.


  7. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 2006au4kwan
    my coach says I need to pull my left arm back to start the rotation and then pick my right foot into the ice.
    Pull your left arm back? If you have your left arm back when you pick to go into the jump, that would create some of your problems! You need to make sure you get your left arm in front to check the 3-turn before jumping.
    - Ashley
    Katy Taylor Online - Fan site for 2006 US Pewter Medalist

  8. #8

    Default

    Yes, my left arm is in front to check my 3-turn...it's from that point on in which i'm still having trouble I am trying out the suggestions. That one by iceskaterdawn is hard to do without me tilting one way or the other...and that's still on the ice!

    I am able to get up and land almost a full rotation but I'm landing with both feet on the ice (having a hard time putting my left foot in front of my right). My coach tells me my legs are still apart in the air

    It's a toe version of the loop, right? I had a really hard time learning that jump. It took me a while to learn how to transfer my weight to my right leg and skate/take off on that back outside edge.

    I'll keep practicing...Thanks for all your input!

  9. #9

    Default

    here's my advice. check out michelles footage in slow motion of her triple flip. not how her arms change position from the left outside 3 turn and how they change again as she pulls in for take off. this may sound crazy but as you watch at full speed, try and do a walk through at the same time.

  10. #10

    Default

    Hello,

    I wanted to report that I finally landed the flip jump on 1 leg Counting back...it took me almost 4 months, whew!

    I tried all of your suggestions which helped a lot but dedicating a lot of time and practice for the jump this past month made the difference.

    My next goal is to improve the quality of the jump and hopefully check the landing in time to add a combo loop or toe loop.

    Thanks again MKFers for your help!

  11. #11

    Heart Sigh...

    I can't do my flip jump either...I love loops..they're soo cool...and like I feel really werid cause like all my friends are like hyper and small...so they jump like mad and they get it...and me ...i'm still in preprelimnary..and they're in like prejunivvile....and my coach rocks she's collete appel...she's soo nice...but she hasn't gotten the test form for me to go to prelimnary yet...sigh sigh sigh...and does anyone have good advice on back spins?

    Figure skating fan forever

  12. Default Flips

    always remember to check head over left sholder!!! but i dont think it will matter as much unless its a triple flip i hate doing triple flip

  13. #13
    Join Date
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    Congrats on landing the flip! Like others have said, if you run into problems with a jump, just watch Michelle in slo-mo........it's helped me immensly!
    Keeper of MK'S Spittle at the end of Campbells 2004

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by donnylutz View Post
    Congrats on landing the flip! Like others have said, if you run into problems with a jump, just watch Michelle in slo-mo........it's helped me immensly!

    That's a good idea.

    Can you suggest who has a great loop jump technique I could watch? For some reason my body just won't do that jump.
    I believe!

    I remain totally in AWE of Michelle Kwan.

    This season just hasn't been the same without her.


    I miss seeing her on the ice.
    I think I always will...
    IF...she steps onto it again
    Oh...my heart stand still....

    _________


  15. #15
    Join Date
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    Can you suggest who has a great loop jump technique I could watch? For some reason my body just won't do that jump.
    I HATE the loop! Every skater has that one jump that just never feels right....even though you can sometimes do it well. Michelle for sure had issues with the loop....though when she did it, it was usually amazingly beautiful. Kristi and Angela Nickodinov hated the salchow.........

    So yes, I hate the loop too! Many skaters have good loops. I really like Kim Yuna's, Sasha's, or even Michelle's at worlds '01 was really wonderful.

    Best of luck to you and me! I finally got my double toe, double salchow, and double flip back....and sort of a double flutz......but that darn loop. Just drives me crazy!

    What helps me is doing the three-turns into it.....kind of like Irina usually did......it can make it harder, but, if you have strong three turns it really keeps your body in the correct posistion and can make the jump a lot easier.

    Good luck! Keep us updated!

    Donnylutz
    Keeper of MK'S Spittle at the end of Campbells 2004

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